“That’s a fact, Doc,” John Black was famous for saying to the love of his life, Dr. Marlena Evans, on many an occasion. And in this exclusive interview, Drake Hogestyn’s first since his character was written out of Days of our Lives a year ago, the soap opera super-hunk delivers many an enlightening factoid.
TVGuide.ca caught up with the 56 year-old Fort Wayne, Ind., native on the third annual soap cruise [soapcruise.com] to discuss the future of soaps, his next career move, and how he became an accidental soap opera superstar.
TVGuide.ca: It’s been a year since John and Marlena rode off into the sunset, er, Switzerland via a wheelchair. Have you finally come to terms with your firing?
Drake Hogestyn: I think our firing was an eye-opener for all of the soaps. We’re moving into a different era … where anything is possible. Everyone needs to prepare himself or herself [for the inevitable].
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TVGuide.ca: Do you think Sony, which owns DAYS and The Young and the Restless, used you and Deidre Hall’s firing as an example and a precedent?
Drake Hogestyn: It’s just business. Going into show business, you need to know the reality — and that means it’s all about the bottom line. It’s funny because when these new kids would come on to our show, they’d be so happy that they landed a three-year contract, but I had to burst their bubble and let them know that what they really had was just a series of 13-week contracts. In this business, you’re only as good as your last show. You have to give your best performance every day because it could be your last. It’s that simple. I’d always take these newbies to my dressing room and make them watch me slide my name tag off my dressing room door because it’s that fast and easy. |
TVGuide.ca: Yeah, but you’re not just anyone. You’re Drake Hogestyn — the male lead of the show.DH: You can’t assume that — even if people tell you that you’ll be on the show until the cows come home. When you look at the show from a fiscal standpoint … listen, we all knew there were budget problems. When NBC cancelled a show [
Passions] that they owned outright, we all immediately knew that
DAYS was on the chopping block next because NBC doesn’t own our show. Looking at my character, even one as popular as John Black, the cost/benefit wasn’t worth it, obviously. And I can see why they made the decision to fire Dee and me despite the fact that I offered to go back to my 1986 salary.
TVGuide.ca: In hindsight, do you wish John Black had just stayed dead the first time DAYS fired you instead of resurrecting him as RoboJohn? Also, did you really think John really died in that car accident — or was that just a publicity ruse/stunt?
DH: No, I knew John was dead, dead. I was fired twice in one year. Not that you are ever prepared for it. DAYS made a decision to change the direction of the show. Now this is my personal opinion, but I think they wanted to change the look of the show, bring in newer faces, new energy and the overall direction of the show. DAYS wanted to keep the show relevant. At the same time, you have to be respectful of your core audience. We’re not attracting a younger demo. It’s a [fallacy]. It’s just not happening. Young adults are busy on YouTube or whatever electronic device is hot at the moment so their needs are already being met. Basically, daytime’s problems boil down to one statement, and that’s, “It’s the economy, stupid!” And it’s visible to the naked eye! For example, take the personal appearances. Years ago, you would see grandmothers, mothers, daughters and babies at these events. Watching soaps was a generational event and pastime. Today, you only see older fans at this appearance — which tells me soaps are not being passed down like an heirloom anymore.
Years ago, Omni magazine had a wonderful article on the power of soap opera and women. Back then, when women heard the theme music of their favourite story come on, they would nurse their child. So, that hour in that day became a very comforting time for the child and mother because they were bonding. Later, if the child is in its playpen crying, it will stop when the soap opera theme music comes on because the baby knows it will be nurtured — and that feeling will remain with them forever. In their adult life, every time said person watches their soap, all those memories will return. And, of course, every mother would pass down that tradition from generation to generation. Today, women don’t have the luxury to work from home any more, so that daily ritual doesn’t exist anymore. Also, when you factor in high production costs, large casts, and digital recording devices, well, it’s hard to find a cure to save this dying industry.
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TVGuide.ca: I hear you’re working behind the scenes with Granada/ITA.
DH: Yes, I am. I have pitched a few non-scripted programs to them. In fact, when we [on the soap cruise] stopped in Key West for the day, I found out one of our projects got the green light. I’m working on the project with my son, Ben. Actually, we’re working on five projects. This particular project is a hybrid of Jeopardy! and Who Wants To Be A Millionaire. Our show is called Down To Earth. It’s a geography game show. Basically, we have Google Earth looking down on the planet as it’s spinning. Our setup? It’s routine — we have three contestants and a host, as Google Earth zeroes down on a specific location somewhere in the world. Contestants have 30 seconds for a chance to win $100,000 to guess where we are zooming into. We already created a sizzle reel with someone who hails from Merv Griffith’s production company. |
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TVGuide.ca: That sounds great! I can see that working …
DH: It did test as a bit difficult for the audience, but I’m not worried about that because there is a smart audience out there for this kind of TV. They’re under-represented out there. That’s why I compared it to
Jeopardy!.
TVGuide.ca: Would you consider acting again?
DH: I would! Once again, I’m a realist. I know I’m getting long in the tooth and Hollywood only cares about youth. So, at my age, you have to start looking behind the camera to pay the mortgage.
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TVGuide.ca: Has anyone approached you to audition?
DH: No. I see a lot of parts out there, but no one is calling me. Without an audition, there is no way you can land a part.
TVGuide.ca: Is it because you’re so identified as John Black?
DH: I don’t know. Recently, Y&R was looking for a leading man, but they said I wasn’t right for the role despite the fact that they were familiar with my work.
TVGuide.ca: Was it the role of Tucker McCall?
DH: Yes, it was. I was interested before William Russ originated the role. The funny thing is that Y&R recently recast the role with Stephen Nichols! I am so happy for Stephen! For that matter, I’m thrilled for any of my former castmates who have lost work this past year and ended up nabbing a gig. |
TVGuide.ca: Who do you still keep in touch with from DAYS?DH: No one, really. Sometimes, we’ll pass a note here and there, but that’s it.
DAYS has always been a big part of my life, but outside of Salem, my family and home were my priorities. In my household, Salem didn’t really exist; my children and wife always came first. Actors are insecure, which is one of the reasons I don’t hang out with actors a lot. Our egos are very fragile. And I try not to think like that, but I am a part of that mentality, so I’m thankful to have my wife, Victoria, who I have been in love with since I met her at a baseball game at the age of 15, to keep my life and career in perspective and in balance. I couldn’t do this without her.
TVGuide.ca: And that’s a fact! So basically the only soap star you hang out with outside of work is your son, Ben!
DH: [Laughs] Yes! He’s such a good kid. I love all my children but Ben and I have a different, special relationship. It’s fun to have acting — and now, production — backgrounds in common. When you think about it, we’re a rather smart team because I have the experience and he has the youthful perspective and ideas networks and audiences want. We’re doing another the game show called Do You Know Your Daughter? that the networks just love. They don’t even want a sizzle reel because the show sold itself. The premise and concept? Clueless fathers trying to prove they know their daughters. That idea comes from my personal experience because I have four daughters — and sometimes, we’re a little dense when it comes to our female children [laughs].
TVGuide..ca: I can see the sequel now — Do You Know Who Your Daughter Is?!
DH: [Laughs] Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I’m not heading into that sensationalist reality genre. I want my shows to be educational, fun and friendly.
TVGuide.ca: Do you think you’re typecast as a soap actor?
DH: I think so. But I believe once some time passes that I’ll be relevant in the acting world again. At the end of the day, a lot of people are typecast — and that’s not necessarily a bad thing. Listen, I played professional baseball, and I was released. Baseball taught me the place failure has in your life. In hindsight, I had 23 years on daytime TV as an actor, so I’m blessed. I can’t complain.
TVGuide.ca: That’s one great gig! Especially for an actor …
DH: [Former DAYS producer] Al Rabin told me it’s hard to find actors who can play these [fantastical, often times nonsensical storylines], but if you can find the kernel of truth in the story or character and play that each time, you’ll do well in daytime. Luckily, I think I managed that despite it being very challenging at times. I also prided myself in knowing my lines — and knowing everyone else’s lines, too! It’s that old line, “practice, practice, practice …” The only time my wife told me I brought the character home was when I was playing the new John Black [or, as fans called him, RoboJohn]. I was studying really hard with my acting coach, Steven Anderson, trying to bring something different forward to the audience and to myself as an actor. Listen, I know I’m famous for my [lifts his eyebrow] mannerisms as John Black, but when DAYS invited me back to the show the last time, I really wanted to reinvent my character and myself as an actor. I had to lose all my energy because John was learning as he went — he was basically a sponge, mimicked people and fed off of people, so I had to adopt a different artistic approach to the ‘new’ John.
TVGuide.ca: In a way, he was more like old John Black …
DH: As an actor, I had great fun exploring this character and his psyche. It remains my biggest challenge to date.
TVGuide.ca: RoboJohn was a huge hit.
DH: Don’t forget I had just been fired as well. Obviously, there was a reason for my firing, so when I returned, I wanted to make sure I was performing at my best and being received by the audience properly. Clearly, it didn’t work out because I was fired again [Laughs]. But I have no regrets. And I was proud of what I accomplished in that short time as the new John.
TVGuide.ca: You should be. When you came back there was something noticeably different about you. It looked like you applied the method acting technique when you played RoboJohn. When I was on the DAYS set, you were in character in the hair/makeup room …
DH: I know, and I’m sorry about that. Um, well, there are many types of method acting. Listen, you know my background — I came out of baseball, and was chosen by Columbia Pictures literally out of the blue in a national casting tour. There were 30 finalists — 29 of them had their SAG card, except for me! So back then, I did study method. But I never really felt comfortable with method. I preferred to listen and react.
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TVGuide.ca: Many believe acting is reacting. How did you react when DAYS wrote John and Marlena’s controversial exit story? Many fans, including myself, were furious that DAYS would essentially give John his memory, and then emasculate him by paralyzing him from the waist down. Sex, as we Jarlena fans know, was a very important component in their relationship — as it should be.
DH: Right! Right! Right! It is what it is. It was what it was. Again, it’s back to business. As we all know, DAYS was up for renewal at that time. Because of that, there was a huge reduction in the licencing fee to get that renewal, so Deidre and I were the casualties. And I don’t blame them. The show’s future is more important than two actors or characters. |
However, I will say that John and Marlena’s storyline did veer off in a new direction when [co-executive producer] Ed Scott was fired. When Gary Tomlin came in to assume control of the show, John immediately ran to Stefano and said, “That’s it. You win. I lose. End of the story.” Right away, that eliminated about four different story threads I was involved in. Naturally, I went up to Gary, and said “What’s happening. Which story direction are we headed in now?” He responded, by saying, “I’m not sure, but something is happening. I’ll get back to you. Let me put my ear to the ground because I think a big story is coming up for you. I’ll know in a couple of weeks!” [Laughs hilariously] A big story, alright! That story in which he referenced involved Sandra Robinson — and ultimately, our exit.
In defence of Gary, however, I must say that Gary and I had an open relationship, so I personally believe he had no idea at that time that Marlena and John would be written out. And like you said the other day, our exit storyline was rushed, so it may have been a last-minute decision on Sony’s part. But at the end of the day, I have an expression I like to express — I like to look at the windshield, and not the rearview mirror. If you keep looking back, you can’t move forward.
TVGuide.ca: Were you surprised at how angry fans were after your second firing? Fans were literally livid. And even the mainstream media was stunned. I had friends who had never watched DAYS calling me and asking me, “What the hell?’
DH: I was surprised. On Election Day, Nov. 4, I voted and went to the gym because I wasn’t working that day. The way it was presented to me was, I got a call from Ken Corday. He said, “Hey, Hogie, did you vote? Oh, great! So, by the way, listen, we’re taking you and Dee off camera for a period of time …” So I asked, “Define a period of time?” He said, “Well, you know how it goes. Writers change …”
TVGuide.ca: That’s funny because there wasn’t an official writer change at that time so clearly that’s more proof that Gary Tomlin and Chris Whitesell are writing the show and not “head writer” Dena Higley.
DH: I guess. But back to your original question about our firings being a harbinger of things to come, I realize that more and more, especially during this soap cruise when I sit and have dinner with Robert Newman and Vincent Irizarry, because we’re all popular leading men in the same age range. Wanna know what they told me? “Your firing made us all really stand up and take notice. At that point, we knew things weren’t all rosy, but we never thought they’d go after the superstars on the soaps. And when they did, we all knew we had to watch our back because the same thing could happen to us if it happened to you!” Our firings essentially opened up the floodgates, which allowed other soap producers to do the same thing to their actors. Guys like Robert and Vincent said, “Before you, we were all in denial, but we’re not anymore.” And all of a sudden, it was Don Diamont being fired from Y&R, Eric Braeden and Susan Lucci being asked to take pay cuts … But back to my experience with DAYS — it’s hard not to take it personally when a show fires you twice in one year! I remember when John “died,” I had to go on an Australian press tour which I had already committed to before being let go. Want to talk about awkward? But I’m a professional, so I went with Dee and Ken Corday. That very day, John’s funeral scenes were airing in America, and despite the fact that Australia airs a couple of years behind, that’s all the press and fans Down Under were asking about. During a talk show, Ken said, “Well, we’re all family here.” And my thought was, “Well, I never killed my family members!” [Laughs]
TVGuide.ca: Soap Opera Digest’s feature editor Mara Levinsky put it best — we, from a distance, assumed there were a few superstars that were essentially untouchable in this business. We were all wrong.
DH: That’s sweet of you and Mara to say. Dee was there long before me — and, of course, my favourite time on the show is the beginning of John and Marlena’s relationship. We were foolproof. Did you know that it was never indicated to me that John Black was Roman Brady? John was intended to be a three-month role. It was a February-to-May-Sweeps storyline. Maybe, just maybe, they’d reevaluate extending my role after that. But hey, what did I know? I had never done a soap before. During those early days, I learned from the best, my friend. During my down time on the set, I spent the entire day running from set to set watching and learning from the likes of Quinn Redeker, Macdonald Carey, and Frances Reid. Talk about experienced pros and actors. Dee would always ask me, “Why are you running around the studio like a mad man?” And I said, “ I am learrrning … I am learrrning! [Laughs]” Since I came from film and never came from tape, I had to learn from the best. Honestly, I was in awe of all these people. I really felt like I was a part of a company that pulled me along. And yes, I admit, I rode on Deidre Hall’s dress-tails! Also, I had no idea how passionate soap fans were. Heck, the fans knew I was Roman before I did [laughs]. This is funny — when I landed DAYS, I told my mother I booked a soap, but I couldn’t remember the name. I said, “It has a ‘Life’ or a ‘Day’ in it,” and she guessed, “Omigod — One Life To Live? You’re moving to the east coast to be closer to me!” Of course, I had to burst her bubble because I told her the soap I was hired on taped in L.A. and then, she naturally guessed DAYS!
TVGuide.ca: That’s a funny story. What’s been the hardest part about leaving DAYS?
DH: The fact that I still wake up every morning at 4:45 a.m. and I have nowhere to go.
TVGuide.ca: When did you realize soaps were in trouble?
DH: When the set turnover stopped. All of a sudden, certain sets stayed up for weeks. And then, of course, the amount of hours we worked diminished. Before we used to work from dawn to sunset. That was a normal day for us. And now, it’s like, “you need to leave before 6 p.m. — at the latest!” Used to be, 90-hour weeks were normal. That doesn’t happen anymore.
TVGuide.ca: Once again, DAYS has managed to become the comeback soap of the decade. Ratings are up, the writing is tight and clean, the acting is impressive, and the Emmys are in love with Salem again. Are you happy for your colleagues? We all thought DAYS would be cancelled after they fired you and Dee — but miraculously Ken Corday and company pulled themselves up from their bootstraps.
DH: Omigod — of course, I’m happy. They’re my friends — I never wanted DAYS to be cancelled. I’m emotionally attached to the show. That’s never going to change. I was released from the Yankees, but I still root for the team! DAYS will always be my show. Forever and always. I was playing for the Salem team for almost a quarter of century — that’s a lifetime!
TVGuide.ca: Do you want to respond to rumours that you, Ken, and Deidre didn’t get along?
DH: Yeah, I’ve heard that before. People want to justify what went on. Ken wrote me a nice letter the other day. In fact, he told me he’s writing a book called something like These Were the Days of our Lives. Ken let me know that there’s a chapter in there about what John Black meant to the show called “I Need A Hero” or “The Magnificent Seven.” Ken told me that he never believes in saying goodbye, but he believes in seeing you later. That was the first time we had contact after he told me the news that I was let go. Ken played down our firing. In fact, he wanted us to keep the whole thing quiet when the firing happened. It was sad because I wanted closure — especially with the crew because I’ve worked with them for my entire professional acting career. So we kept it quiet. Let me tell you, I took a lot of mental photographs before the news of our departure leaked. Despite the shock of us leaving, I have to say, it was a memorable time because I looked at everything in a different way.
TVGuide.ca: Eileen Davidson told me she was shocked that you and Dee didn’t get a going-away party. DAYS was infamous for those cakes!
DH: I love Eileen! She lives a stones throw away from me in Malibu. We had a blast working together. We see each other all the time at the gym. As for the going-away party, none of that stuff ever bothered me. Hey, DAYS saved a few bucks on the cake [laughs]! All I thought, when I left the studio for the final time, was moonshine [laughs]! A few of us did have a going-away party on the sidelines. And yes, we literally did drink some moonshine! |
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TVGuide.ca: Less is more. Do you think DAYS jumped the shark when they kept revising John’s history and parentage? And what do you think Jarlena is up to now? Is he finally walking and banging Marlena?DH: [Laughs hilariously] Dee and I had so much chemistry. We loved each other, seriously. We both had each other’s back. You know what? When fans send me John and Marlena montages, I see them so differently now. I see what they see now — so clearly. I see our chemistry. I get it now in a way I never did before because I’m so removed from it now. I never watched myself before when I was working, but now that I am, I understand why the fans loved Marlena and John so much. Even though my dad would always call me and demand I watch a certain scene because he thought I sucked during a certain episode [laughs]! The way these fans put together these montages, well, wow … they really capture our magic. Dee and I were real.
TVGuide.ca: You’re a huge bookmark in my life. In 1985, I began watching soaps for the first time right around the time when John Black arrived in Salem, but you’re also the first person that prompted me to realize that I was gay thanks to that marvelous hairy chest of yours! My mother really hates you, by the way!
DH: [Laughs] Wow. That’s amazing. I’m honoured. You know, as soap stars, I don’t think we really realize how profound our impact has on people’s lives — which is why I think this industry really needs to survive. That’s amazing. Thank you. Isn’t our little business great?
TVGuide.ca: It is. That’s why I was so angry when DAYS kept reinventing John Black’s identity.
DH: Listen, I know. It’s called too many cooks in the kitchen. I literally had a diagram in my dressing room mapping out John’s history and family ties. It confused me [laughs]! I mapped it out like how you’d construct sentences. I have a very mathematical mind. Do you remember the dungeon in Maison Blanche?
TVGuide.ca: Of course.
DH: Well, that was my worst time on the show. It was a great storyline — and I loved, loved working with Joe Mascolo. And you know soaps, they never give the boys a lot to play with … but we had a blast. Alas, I ended up [pissed off and sad with the denouement of the story] because they made me shave off my beard before we taped this huge Christ moment, the final scene, the climax of the story, where John is chained to the wall where he’s screaming out for God’s help. And I knew the next arc of the story was the biblical storyline, the priest plot. So here I am, digging and salivating to tape that moment, but then NBC announces that I’m hosting the Emmy Awards so they made me shave my beard off. James was on vacation and [former show runner] Tom Langan went off to New York, so I couldn’t talk to anyone when this rewrite came in when Stefano all of a sudden says, “Oh, John Black, we need to shave and shower you now while you are my prisoner!” Um, I don’t think so! I tried to go through protocol but my concerns were never addressed. Oh, James and I were livid! I’m still livid over that. In fact, James flipped out when he heard but it was too late for him to change it. Remember when Tony said, “What did fahhh-therrrr do to you?” Yikes. Well, he bathed and showered me. It looked like I went to Club Med. It was a fantastic storyline, one of my faves, but it was all lost because of network politics. Ahhh, those were the great days.
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TVGuide.ca: Do you think James Reilly wrote John the best?
DH: I think so. Yeah. James wrote epic stories for John and I will always be grateful to him for that. James wrote me the nicest note when John first put on his priest collar. Marlena, who was the devil but morphed into Kristen, was knocking on the door, and there were a few apples by the door, and I looked at the door, looked at the apples, and then I instinctively decided to take a bite into the apple before I answered the door. And James flipped out, “Omigod — that was amazing. Brilliant! The forbidden fruit!” He loved it! And I’m proud to say that was my idea. |
TVGuide.ca: James loved John and Marlena …DH: But you know what? Dee and I were smart to never address him as actors but as characters. I remember when John Aniston yelled at him during the Emmy Awards complaining about how these snot-nosed kids were thwarting him after he outsmarted the CIA, etc.. Aniston was like, “Victor is smarter than that — something needs to change.” James’s response? “It will.” Well, literally the next day, a rewrite came in and Victor ended up in a coma after a heart attack! James was very passionate about the show. This is a testament to James’s power at NBC — the network was furious because John is Jennifer Aniston’s father, but all he said was, “You keep him happy. He’s off my show.” And as we know, James won that battle. But when James went to
Passions, Victor miraculously came out of his coma. When it came to James, if he saw you out of character, you were done.
TVGuide.ca: James was truly one of the greats — just like Irna Phillips and William Bell. The universe they created was real to them. As John Black once was to all of us.
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Nelson Branco is a Toronto freelance entertainment journalist, who regularly contributes to Hello! Canada, The National Post, The Los Angeles Times' theenvelope.com, TV Guide USA, tvguide.com, Inside Entertainment, OUT, and fab magazine, along with spearheading the soap coverage for TVGuide.ca's popular daytime TV hub. After graduating from Ryerson University in 1997, he moved from Toronto to New York in 1998 to take on the roles as senior news editor at Soap Opera Update. Branco first freelanced for Soap Opera Weekly as an intern in 1994, and after leaving Soap Update to help create and launch Bauer Publishing's In Touch Weekly in 2003, Branco continued to freelance occasionally for its sister publication, Soaps In Depth. Most recently, he helped create and launch Canada's first celebrity magazine, Weekly Scoop in 2005 as its news and entertainment director. Branco is also a contributor to a new TV show titled Planet Soap to air in Canada and America.
